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July 13, 2012
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Please be careful WHAT you SELL for POINTS!

Journal Entry: Fri Jul 13, 2012, 7:10 PM


Dear members,

as we all know this delicious new function has been enabled by DeviantART recently which allows you to sell content for points and keep the amazing amount of 80% of your share.

Overall this is a nice new function and we can't wait to see what you will do with it. We just want to warn you to be careful about one certain thing:

You should not sell high res files of your work for a small amount of points.

The few dimes people will spare by not having to pay shipping costs can do you badly.
There are a lot of companies, that take your dear work and print it on T- Shirts, books, posters and what not.

And in the past those companies at least had to put the efford into taking your art and retouching it. But shall you think about selling high res files for a small amount of points, greedy companies as that will have it even easier to take your art, distribute it big, and give you nothing of your share!

Companies  from different countries, (especially countries with "vague" laws about copyright) are usually almost impossible to sue, and they know that.

PLEASE KEEP IN MIND THAT 1 point is = 1.25 CENTS!!!

So before sharing your dearest high res files for points,  please think twice. It's really not worth the unhappyness it could cause you once you see what those companies are doing with it.


Please share this information with your friends since they might not be aware of this issue yet!

EDIT:
We removed refering to countries with which we have had major problems in the past. (Please keep in mind that those two were just examples and that we are talking about COMPANIES, not people, and refer to our experiences. We can, of course, also name the Lieberman incident for an example, of which there clearly exist too many.)

Add a Comment:
 
:icondogmaticloki:
DogmaticLoki Featured By Owner Nov 4, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
How do you actually get this platform. Explain in the simplest way I'm really stupid and confused. Thank you for the information as well.
Reply
:iconrebeccaemilycooper:
RebeccaEmilyCooper Featured By Owner Sep 28, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
Good information to know! Thank you!
Reply
:iconbolsterstone:
bolsterstone Featured By Owner Sep 3, 2012   General Artist
It's starting to sound here like you can cash in points. (Haven't seen that's the case yet.)
Reply
:iconhawa777:
hawa777 Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2012  Student Digital Artist
by the way, how to set the button?
Reply
:icontoatoneart:
ToAtoneArt Featured By Owner Aug 28, 2012  Professional Writer
Poor :iconpoorsouls-stock: had something like this happen not long ago. She made a beautiful photo shoot, and a company out of Korea took one of her pics, added scissors into her hand, and now use it as a headliner for their add campaign. She was never asked, and hasn't seen a dime. :( She has a whole journal about it.
Reply
:icongoldsheep:
GoldSheep Featured By Owner Jul 18, 2012
"efford"-->"effort"
spelling mistake.... minor, though.
Reply
:iconyangtianli:
yangtianli Featured By Owner Jul 16, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
thanks a lot for the warning!!
Reply
:iconnotsousual:
NotSoUsual Featured By Owner Jul 16, 2012   Digital Artist
I think the whole selling for points system we can do without.
Reply
:iconpurplecupcakes:
PurpleCupcakes Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
It would also be good to point out that no one NEEDS to sell this stuff through DA. I've see people selling stock images on here for years without DA taking a cut. :\
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
That is true they don't need to.
Well, from a business point of view it doesn't hurt to earn some extra money (through DA); people would just have to know that they probably won't be able to make a living out of that and what stuff they should better not sell here... or am I missing something right now?

Braiiinns... :)
Reply
:iconpurplecupcakes:
PurpleCupcakes Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
What I meant was, you don't need to sell anything through DA. You can cut out the middle man (DA) and just sell right to the buyer. People have been doing it on here for years; DA has just found a way to get in on the deal and make money off it by setting this up.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
Oh, the middle man problem!

Sorry thinking about delicious brains all day makes me sometimes go slowly. :)

So. You've really got a point with the middle man problem. I guess in that case it depends if the artist wants to do the monetizing himself or give DA 20 percent to do that for him. Artitst who have always been selling stuff on their own might refrain from switching to the new system because they are used to doing the monetizing themselves I guess.
Reply
:iconshattered-earth:
Shattered-Earth Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012   Digital Artist
I don't like that you single out specific countries for this, this kind of crap happens even in the US. There are people in the US that will look for stock images to use in their commercial works like book covers and site layouts and they will try to rip artists off all the time.

Just remind people that 1 point is = 1.25 CENTS.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
"Just remind people that 1 point is = 1.25 CENTS"

That's good to know!!!
Reply
:iconshattered-earth:
Shattered-Earth Featured By Owner Jul 15, 2012   Digital Artist
Yes, people often forget that :( thanks for editting the journal!
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 15, 2012  Professional Filmographer
Well after all this journal is supposed to inform artists, not to rasie a discussion about certain countries. :)

:hug:
Reply
:iconcalaymo:
Calaymo Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
thanks for the info.
:hug:
Reply
:iconskaera:
Skaera Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Thanks for singling out China and Russia, I'm sure the Chinese and Russians appreciate it.
I feel like it's to soon to tell if this is a major concern or not... I'd give it some time.
Reply
:icongosteoner:
GosteOner Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
i think some1 needs to invade both China and Russia and steal their internets.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
BRAINS! :D
Reply
:iconbeaudeeley:
beaudeeley Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
I won't be taking part... it sounds like it will make it really easy for people to rip off artists even more than they already are.
Reply
:iconkafine:
kafine Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012   General Artist
Oh good greif somehow I missed the introduction of this function. This is awful, the points system was already encouraging a massive price crash with their warped perception of value... This isn't going to help o-O
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
Price cash? Now of that I didn't catch wind. What happened?
Reply
:iconkafine:
kafine Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012   General Artist
Go and look in the job forums, you will see people trading artwork for literally pennies.

It wasn't quite this bad before the points system. You'd get people working for $2 or something which is still ridiculous, but now you will see people working for less than 10 points (13 cents), people telling eachother that 50 points (63 cents) is way too expensive for their hard work, and trying to sell anything for over 2000 (about $25) is pretty much useless. The sense of value of DA points seems to be severely overinflated.

If I wanted to sell a painting for $300, which is not expensive, the price would be 25,000 points. DA users won't pay it now that they expect to get artwork for 5 points.

This effectively excludes me from using the system, even if I wanted to, without driving my prices into the dirt like so many have.

I wish points would go away and they would just display site credit in actual currency that is transparent about its value.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
WoW it seems like people are totally not getting how much money 1 point is worth.

That kind of dumping is really bad, I had no idea that it has already gone so low!
(Until you told me I thought those 10 dollar rates we see everywhere were low, wow!)

Well I think that your rate for a painting is totally reasonable and in the professional field even on the lower end. Since I don't know you, please allow me to ask, are you doing art for a living or do you have a job in another field?

Just curios... but I still think no matter if you do it for a living or as a hobby you should get a fair share. Though let's say, kids trading art, them all not having much money and not having large distribution ways would do ok with charging such low rates (among each other). They just need to learn/ and understand that it works much different with companies etc.
Reply
:iconjeremiahlambertart:
JeremiahLambertArt Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional General Artist
thansk for the info. although i dont think there is anything "amazing" about 80%. the standard rate of most art dealers is 3 to 10%. so don't go applauding that which is not worthy of it in my opinon. sure dA potential viewing is millions. but we all know that unless you get lucky with a DD or just some other lightning strike... then your views are a sorta puny 10 to 100 a day. not that i dont appreciate those. cause i do. but yeah.... i digress.
Reply
:iconaerozopher:
Aerozopher Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
good point!
Reply
:iconnathie:
nathie Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
Exactly my thoughts too!
Reply
:icondrclosure:
DrClosure Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
I totally agree with you, when i saw this new interesting function on dA I imediately tought that it can also be a really bad thing, I'll share this information! Thanks!
Reply
:iconnishagandhi:
nishagandhi Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
thanks for the info!! :)
Reply
:icondoozza:
doozza Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012
I am russian, Ilive in Russia, and I know how it's done. What you are saying about Russia is slander. All the mentioned T-shirts are imported, but not produced here. The 99.9% of tags are 'Made in China'. Be careful with what you say, and do some research first.
Reply
:iconbeaudeeley:
beaudeeley Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
The tags saying 'made in China' doesn't prove much. Russia is well renowned for its piracy.
Reply
:icondoozza:
doozza Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
Production in Russia became too expensive since the USSR fell apart. To establish major production means to spend a lot on development or purchase of proper equipment. It is much cheaper to import, rather than produce. It's a major problem in modern Russia - little funding of scientific research and technology.
Piracy of the pirate-bay style is popular in Russia, I admit it - because of low income in comparison to the world (buying a $60 computer game is hardly affordable when engineers get $450 month salary). That's a little bit different sort of piracy.
Reply
:iconbeaudeeley:
beaudeeley Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
Fair enough, Australia is expensive enough to have things produced so I guess it's worse over there.
Reply
:iconkxzxw:
KXZXW Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
I was thinking that too lol Russia and China? Why not throw in Canada?
Reply
:iconjeremiahlambertart:
JeremiahLambertArt Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional General Artist
i want to see some proof on these "facts". on both ends. cause it seems sketchy anyway you look at it.
Reply
:icondoozza:
doozza Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012
On what ends do you want proof? How can I show you something that doesn't exist? If you ever find a T-shirt that says 'Произведено в России' - you can prove me wrong. On the other hand, almost any clothes cheaper $100 you buy in Russia says 'Made in China'.
Reply
:iconjeremiahlambertart:
JeremiahLambertArt Featured By Owner Jul 15, 2012  Professional General Artist
that's my point. neither side has proof. them harping up and you scolding back all seems futile. but i think it goes without saying.... a shirt that says "Made in ...." has absolutely no bearing to where at and what was printed on it.
Reply
:iconwilliam-scott:
William-Scott Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012  Student Digital Artist
This is very informative, Thank you
Reply
:iconlastofasmagth:
lastofasmagth Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
thanks, but I like some helps , may be somebody with more experience, can tell us what are a fair rate,
to get a idea of how valuable our work
Reply
:iconwynterphoenyx:
WynterPhoenyx Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012  Student Digital Artist
I know some artist reccomend taking the average amount of total time it takes you to make a piece and just multiply it by minimum wage. So if it takes you 5 hours to do a piece from start to finish then you should ask for ~$40, but it also depend on the quality of your art and how much people are willing to pay too.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
You should charge $40 hourly, not daily!
Reply
:iconanako-art:
Anako-ART Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
$40 is definitely too little for a piece that someone may use commercially! even for an hour of work it would be too little. the prices are generally in hundreds of dollars at least, depending on the type of licence that you're selling.

commercial art isn't cheap and artists who don't work in this business should know that in case some company ask them for selling their work & licence.
Reply
:iconwynterphoenyx:
WynterPhoenyx Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Student Digital Artist
As I said, it also depends on the quality of your art and how much people are willing to pay. I forgot to add in what your intent is too. I just figured ~lastofasmagth was just thinking of doing commissions on dA. But yeah, I've seen artists ask for a lot more,way more, than that if they're with a company. It all depends on the circumstances.
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
Well... yeah I get what you mean.
However, quality is a very problemtaic word when it comes to art, because art is so subjective, and because of other reasons connected to business.

Allow me to share my opinion; I would rather think of factors like these:

- Is the customer a person or a company?
- Does this person plan to further on distribute my work?
- Does this person or company plan to have me sign a buy out contract?

Talking about a company, my part of the share largely depends on their ways of distribution and how much money will be earned there. When the company is going to sell 1 million T- Shirts with my work, then I should get a fair share of that.
Buy outs are ripping out artists for small prices. While they are working their asses off and still can't make a living of it, the company earns big deal.

This explains why I find it important to make a difference and I say, I don't mind when kids trade their stuff for a small number of points, for that they have small money and even smaller distribution ways. It just is important to understand that then DA is perhaps the wrong place for you to work as a professional, and that you definatly should ask for different payment when working for a company. :)
Reply
:iconwynterphoenyx:
WynterPhoenyx Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Student Digital Artist
Makes sense to me :) I agree with everything you've said, although I think some people use dA as a place to get started in the professional world, but I wouldn't really know since I prefer to draw for fun and as a side business not as a main income.
Reply
:iconlastofasmagth:
lastofasmagth Featured By Owner Jul 13, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
oh¡ thanks that info is invaluable
Reply
:iconanako-art:
Anako-ART Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
$40 is definitely too little for a piece that someone may use commercially! even for an hour of work it would be too little. the prices are generally in hundreds of dollars at least, depending on the type of licence that you're selling.

commercial art isn't cheap and artists who don't work in this business should know that in case some company ask them for selling their work & licence.
Reply
:iconlastofasmagth:
lastofasmagth Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
ho ¡, thanks, mmm...
Amateur isn't a licence valid right?
XD
but Thanks a lot, definitely this information , helps any one
by the way,
your work is awesome
Reply
:iconzombiesandwich:
ZombieSandwich Featured By Owner Jul 14, 2012  Professional Filmographer
What do you mean by "Amateur isn't a licence valid right?" ?

I think you better go to Wikipedia and check up what things like "Exclusive License" and "Buy Out" mean for instance.

Buy out can affect everyone, no matter if professional or amateur. Licenses don't calculate that much if you are a pro or a beginner, they calculate with the margin of money that can be earned by certain ways of distribution, and how much your share would be then.
Reply
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